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dump on Trump

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote franciscosan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Nov 2016 at 12:38
es bih, I think we all want the last word..... <grin>

As far as California is concerned, the article talks about registering citizens, now it may be that they also register illegal aliens and don't pay attention to whether they're legal or not, democrats do tend to like voter registration, and keeping it loose.  There tend to be more democrats than republicans, but republicans tend to have their act together better.  Democrats are opposed to voter identification schemes and republicans are usually more in favor of them.  Democrats block them on civil rights claims, and republicans argue that it is a small price to pay for insuring than only legal voters vote.  I've heard anecdotal reports about illegals voting, but I am not certain how documented it is, and how can it be?  Democrats claim there is not much fraud, but how do they know? they work to keep the system loose.

Do you want to quit?  Just doing my part to keep a thread alive here.  I've tried starting up other things, but with limited success.  I did suggest that maybe we should stop this thread, and wait and see how the Trump presidency goes.  Conclude the pre-election thread.  But other people want the last word and, frankly, so do I:)
I've asked pro Trump people whether they could admit that he could make a mistake, and I have gotten no response.  Now, I am not asking so I could hold it over their head and beat them with it if _I_ thought he made a mistake.  I am asking for them to admit not to me, but to themselves, if he did something that _they_ think it was a mistake.  There is a play (that I have never read) by Alexander Solzynetsin call "We Don't Make Mistakes" which was the attitude in Soviet Russia.  That is the attitude in tyrannies, and I wonder if it is the attitude in Putin's Russia.  Democracies are flawed and imperfect, it is only in tyrannies that "perfection" reigns. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote wolfhnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 2016 at 09:45
There is nothing more pointless than listening to two educated people argue their
ideology. The reason I supported Trump is his education was out in the world where the nuances of intellectual discourse are not all consuming. Crude is the solution to the mental masturbation that passes for policy discussion between the left and right. Illegal immigration is illegal, Islam is a political system not a race, the battle of the sexes cannot be solved by political correctness, Western European socialism has been paid for by U.S. military spending, the Southern border is proof that you have to lock your doors to keep criminals out, free trade is impossible with oligarchies, the primary function of government is security, welfare has destroyed minorities families, the abortion issue has been radicalized by cultural Marxism, are universities are producing ideologues not productive citizens, places like Australia and Japan should share the risk as well as the benefits of a nuclear shield. The obvious does not require the nuances that paralyze intellectuals or turn them into ideologues.

The debate over quantum randomness is important because determinism was the last unassailable absolute practical truth. It reframes the limitations of the human intellect.

Every thing we know about the world comes to us through our senses with all the imperfections that implies. The certainty of death can be confirmed by our senses it is not abstract but the meaning is abstract. Perhaps more importantly the certainty of death has little application. Without knowing the time, place, and means our knowledge of death is incomplete. The certainty of death could be said to be in the domain of truths that derive their meaning from the abstractions that our necessarily the product of those truths. So while there are non abstract absolute truths we do not have an absolute way of applying them. For other absolute truths such as those that originated as as abstractions such as mathematical truths their utility by design is derived by their absolute but artificial nature.

Empiricism is our reality, complex ideas are built up over time bases on observations that our hidden in our collective memory. Our reality is derived by physical and cultural evolution that is so complex that inventors cannot trace the origins of their inventions. Popular talk of emergence that seek to explain our faculty for invention approaches mysticism. Evolution is proof that complexity arises spontaneously and requires nothing but observable "natural" processes. If we want to understand the meaning of truth we should likewise turn to that which is empirically derived. Truths that have no practical application should be left to the mystics.

Some people will suggest that there are moral truths that are not empirically derived that our absolute. I would suggest that those truths fall under the same category as mathematical truths. Their application depends on a artificial closed system that enforces consistency. In other words they are by their nature simplifications that can only model reality not encompass it. Our moral models and those of physics are approximations of a reality that no one will ever fully understand. Complex chaotic systems will always confound scientists and philosophers alike. The approximations will get better but never be complete. The last hope for an absolute truth that had meaning by being practically applied died when scientists discovered that information likely passes in and out of the universe.

When people talk of the virtue of principle remind them of the virtue of humility. Remind them that their practical truths are approximations. As Dennett points out we do not need quantum randomness to be moral agents our approximate freewill and approximate truths are close enough. The danger of ideologies comes from their absolutism.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote franciscosan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2016 at 09:32
Clothing Monster (T-shirts) has a shirt with a jeep hanging between two boulders and the motto:  Confidence:  the feeling you have before you fully understand the situation.  Reminds me of Trump, but one way or another, for better or worse, he (and we) will figure out the hard way whether it is beyond him or not.  In any case, successful presidents have to grow into the role.

I have read a little Dennett, 28 years ago (Elbow Room).  What I remember is the Sphexish Wasp.  He is a little too reductionist, materialist for me.  I prefer Rene Descartes on the Mind/Body problem, not because he is right, but because his dualism presents the paradox clearly. (Physical/Mental don't interact, Body/Mind do interact).

I believe in free will, but I also think that we are not really in a position to absolutely know.  Free will seems necessary to have people truly be moral agents.  Of course, people could be determined (by the cosmos, God, whatever) to believe in free will, and in themselves being a moral agent.  Or they could be free and choose to believe in a determinism.  For some reason people believe that is not, say the criminal's fault, we shouldn't blame them.  But likewise we could say it is not our fault that we want to heinously torture them either and so we should just go with our impulse, just like they did.  I prefer to think that they are at fault and blameworthy, and we are at fault for how we treat them too.

I think that it is important to make a distinction between (pre)-determinism, and predestination.  Predestination (like Calvinism) believes that things are determined, and that we can know whether the determination of ourselves is going to be good or bad.  For example, the rich man is being rewarded for being a good person.  (Pre)-determinism says things will be worked out in a deterministic manner, but it does not imply that we can figure out whether we are on the right side or not, before the "game" ends.  Still I believe in free will, things may be determined, but I don't think we are in any (epistemic) position to absolutely know whether it is determinism or free will, and I find predestination to be very presumptuous. 

Mysticism is all about practice.  Chanting, prayer, meditation, singing, arts, even actions in every day life, especially actions in everyday life done in a contemplative manner.  That is what mysticism is all about.  But yes, one does not absolutely know in a scientific manner whether the "object" of mysticism is true, then again, science seems to me to be inductive, and so the "truth" we get from it isn't absolute anyways.

How much water do you think we will need to construct a wall through the Arizona and New Mexico desert?  Is Trump going to pay for the thousands of miles of wall and the cost to police it?  Making a wall would cause more problems than it solves.

Now it is not just Trump that doesn't understand the situation that the Southwest is in as far as water is concerned.  Carter proposed a coal slurry from Wyoming to Chicago, and Reagan proposed the M-X system of bunkers and tracks in the Nevada desert.  But, if people back east want to solve our water problem first.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wolfhnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2016 at 10:34
What about the Canadian border? The Wall is idiocy. Trump supporters are idiots but at least most are somewhat respectful of the law. Sanctuary cities are just cultural Marxists playing with identity politics to make way for a collectivist utopia.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote wolfhnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2016 at 10:51
“Ridicule is man’s most potent weapon.” There is no defense. It’s irrational. It’s infuriating. It also works as a key pressure point to force the enemy into concessions.

Saul Alinsky


These are the weapons of social justice warriors the left's brigade of cultural Marxists zombies. Most people never understand where they are being lead until it's too late. Germans didn't vote for war and genocide when the Nazis came to power they voted for national socialism. Most people in Australia, Canada and Western Europe are unaware they are sliding into collectivist authoritarian hell.

Conservatism isn't the answer classical liberalism is.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote franciscosan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2016 at 13:15
You know, I would like to say that once upon a time, I smuggled coke across the Canadian border.  Of course, it was only Coca Cola original formula (not available in the states, except for Mexican grocery stores), and I just had a couple of case in the trunk.  Some Coca Cola affectionados prefer the original formula over Coke Classic.
I wouldn't say they are idiots, I would say that they don't appreciate the difficulties, and don't want to appreciate the difficulties.  Some are near the border and it influences them directly.  Others feel that the growth of Spanish speakers and, more importantly, the acommodation of Spanish speakers is a threat.  In the long run, it probably isn't, in the short run, it probably is.  Others still, are getting on the bandwagon.
I am easily humored, and wish to share it;)  IF they were idiots we wouldn't be having this 'difficulty.'<grin>  The word "idiot" in its original ancient Greek means "private person," so if the loudmouths were "idiots" in the ancient Greek sense, we wouldn't be hearing from them:P  They _were_ "private persons" but a lot of them are motivated towards more more "participation" because they are pissed off.  Trump is to some degree whipping them up, and to some degree taking advantage of them being aggravated already.  Politically obtuse, maybe, idiot, well maybe that too...

"Ridicule is man's most potent weapon," but it won't work in a knife fight.  Trump trusts in polite standards from other people, some people less polite would stick a shiv in him and let the hot air out.  How many kids have said less to a police officer, and gotten taser or maced for it.  Well, maybe not that many, but you get my point.

Are you familiar with the CATO institute?  I am not a fan of the Roman Cato, but I like the organization which is probably what you call Classical Liberalism.  PJ O'Rourke and, Penn and Teller are members. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wolfhnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2016 at 14:13
CATO institute is right wing from my point of view but I read their articles. I don't trust anyone especially if I suspect they are ideologically driven.

Here is the latest article I read.

https://www.cato.org/publications/policy-analysis/five-myths-about-economic-inequality-america

My objection is they are arguing against the left's narrative without addressing the real issue which is income disparity or equity not equality. You don't have to be a socialist to understand that there is relationship between low wages and economic stimulus.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote franciscosan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Dec 2016 at 10:27
I get a 404 error when I try to look it up.  I don't see income disparity as a "problem" except insofar as it irritates some people with jealousy or envy or what some consider "high minded" emotions of "justice" and "equality," at least half of those feelings would be solved by the advice of "mind your own business."  I am not sure what relationship between low wages and economic stimulus you are talking about.  Maybe the answer to whether minimum wage should be a "living wage" is should it be assumed that people are going to stop and stay on the lowest tier of the economic ladder?  The problem for some people (and disproportionately for minorities) is not that people get a "living wage," but the question of whether they get on the ladder at all.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wolfhnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Dec 2016 at 11:12
Ford understood you have to pay your workers enough that they can buy your products but of course he also liked the Nazis because he hated Jewish bankers.

The great ponzi scheme, that uses an artificial inflated dollar, to produce unlimited derivatives is the post consumer economy. Russia, China, and I ran may bring the house of cards down.

Putting the U.S. back to work producing something other than worthless financial instruments may very well be the key to global security. Unfortunately are best minds are occupied creating an endless stream of new ponzi schemes.

The greatest economic boom the U.S. has ever seen came at a time of expanding unions and historically high wages for workers. If we stop immigration the current crop of immigrants that are hard working but disadvantaged could fuel an economic renaissance if they were given equitable wages. The current middle class on the other hand produces little of value in their bureaucratic jobs. What passes for economic stimulus in the tech sector is really little more than entertainment.

Circus and bread is a sure way to destroy an economy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote franciscosan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Dec 2016 at 08:14
Was that the same time period when the rest of the world was in shambles from a World War (expanding Unions and historically high wages)?  It is easy to promise unions the sky when there is no competition for labor.  I don't really have a problem with immigrants and foreigners who are "hungry" enough to get out there and work whether it is here or overseas.  It seems to me that American labor has priced itself a great deal out of the market.  And so we are supposed to put up tariffs and protectionism so that we can have a state of the art 1980s version of industry?  Whether you are catering to companies or catering to unions, it sounds to me like just another form of crony capitalism.

Unions will tell you that you can't just hire someone of the street, making people hard to fire, also makes it for companies hard to hire.  IF you make the cost of hiring someone prohibitive, by adding more things that a company will have to give them, companies will do without.  That means that the poorest people will have a difficulty getting jobs, jobs which should be, for them, merely the first step of the economic ladder.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wolfhnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Dec 2016 at 08:32
Unions are a different topic we were discussing the benefits of higher wages.

We are in the post consumer economy so it gets a bit complicated. I certainly don't mourn conspicuous consumption but I'm concerned about ponzi scheme derivatives.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote franciscosan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Dec 2016 at 10:06
ok, we can set unions aside for now, although I think they're relevant to Trump since the defection of organized labor gutted the Democratic party.  
 I think that there are pressures in other countries that hold in rein the huge dichotomies between the salaries of the "average worker" and the "corporate executive" (for example Germany).  But one thing you can say about the German workers, is that in general they are much more highly skilled.  My brother is a former teacher, and now an administrator in a school district.  One thing he says is that there is a backlog for apprenticeships, the average apprentice in plumbing? is in age in the mid 30s.

Didn't think of that ahead of time, but now we are back to unions which are the ones who are supposed to set up apprenticeships, but as far as I know, have fallen down on that score.  I have a friend who is renovating his kitchen, I mean that he+another guy who is a professional are laying tile, etc.  My friend was a restorationist for pottery and ceramics, and since he wants it "done right," he is forced to do it himself, and thus learn a whole new set of skills to do so.  Point is, most construction workers in the United States get jobs in construction because that is the path of less resistance.  They learn on the job, not as formal apprentices, but through trial and error and association with others, who may or may not have formal training.  People go into construction not so much as a calling, but by default, because they can't go into anything else.  Think of the stereotype of shop class, something for people who are good at nothing else (poor grades), and probably not that good at shop either. 'If you can't do anything else (college)... etc. etc.  It used to be said (in the 70s) that you wanted to know what day of the week your car was made, because you didn't want the workers to be drunk or hung over and they always, Monday (after the weekend), Thursday (after hump day), Friday (get an early start on Friday night).  Someone, had this god awful rattle in their car and finally had to take it half apart to find out the problem.  The workers in the plant thought it would be funny to drape a chain across the inside of the backseat.  I am sure it was funny to them, and I am sure that customer probably didn't buy American again.  Of course, i am sure that hasn't happened to many people. but exactly whose high wages should be protected?  Those who have earned them, or those who feel entitled to them?  My friend is buying up German tools before Trump puts a tariff on them.  They are made on an entirely different level (and price) than the American (or Japanese) tools, but my friend thinks it is worthwhile, because that way they're incredibly ergonomically designed but also with their advanced safety design he can "keep his fingers."

But yes, wages are a problem, but so are skills and quality and, of course, incentives for both.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wolfhnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Dec 2016 at 12:45
In the end it all comes down to voting with your dollars and postponed gratification.  The problem today is that there are no Fords willing to invest in their society.  The financial markets have become the economy instead of greasing the wheels of the economy something that Ford predicted would happen if the banksters were left unchecked.

There is no good way to back out of institutionalized insanity because as soon as someone points out the emperor has no clothes social order dissolves or in this case the ponzi schemes collapse taking us with them.  I'm not looking for a revolution just to put some clothes back on the emperor.  Instead of shaming Trump we should be shaming Clinton and her wall street cronies.

The current economy no longer determines value because people have no values.  We don't respect hard work and meaningful contributions to society we respect celebrity and political pedigree.  Hard working productive people are seen as chumps.  When parasites like the Clintons are held in high regards you know something is desperately wrong.  

You say you want a revolution
Well, you know
We all want to change the world
You tell me that it's evolution
Well, you know
We all want to change the world

But when you talk about destruction
Don't you know that you can count me out

Don't you know it's gonna be alright
Alright, alright

You say you got a real solution
Well, you know
We'd all love to see the plan
You ask me for a contribution
Well, you know
We're all doing what we can

But if you want money for people with minds that hate
All I can tell you is brother you have to wait

Don't you know it's gonna be alright
Alright, alright, al...

You say you'll change the constitution
Well, you know
We all want to change your head
You tell me it's the institution
Well, you know
You'd better free your mind instead

But if you go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao
You ain't going to make it with anyone anyhow

Don't you know know it's gonna be alright
Alright, alright

Alright, alright
Alright, alright
Alright, alright
Alright, alright
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote franciscosan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec 2016 at 09:31
Nobody is shaming Trump, because Trump is shameless.

I don't like the word "value" because (that usage of) value was originally introduced (in the 18th century(?)) in order to put intangible ideas (now called "values") on an economic scale.  Do you "value" kindness more than $100?  What about $100,000?  The term "value" relativizes everything.  Virtue on the other hand, should be absolute, one ought to be "courageous."  Now courage may be between cowardice and foolhardiness, but it is not on a sliding scale.  If I pay you $10, will you be foolhardy?  No.  What about $1 million?  You should still be courageous, although what that consists of may be debatable, no matter what the price.   
Again, Baba O'Reilly by the Who
Meet the new boss,
same as the old boss,
just like yesterday,
I get on my knees and pray,
"we don't get fooled again."

something like that.

Ford had a social engineering agenda, I think people are much more cautious about that today.  Hershey built a company town in Cuba, and it was nice but the races were kept separated.  Bill Gates and Warren Buffett donate a lot to social causes, but of course, they have a lot to start.  Just because your rich doesn't mean you are virtuous, no matter what Norman Vincent Peale said.  The fact that you are rich, means that you are rich.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toyomotor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec 2016 at 10:14
It seems to me that the further this post goes, the further from the OP it wanders.
“The biggest surprise in a man’s life is old age.”
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wolfhnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec 2016 at 10:31
You vote for what you value by how you spend. In the post consumer economy the collective value of ordinary citizens dollar votes is diminished and to some extent overshadowed by the vote of financial institutions that proudly proclaim that social values have no place in the market.

It isn't that I admire consumerism it has to do with the necessity for extended small d democracy in a liberal society. The temptation for the mob to vote themselves circus and bread is tempered by high living standards and a voice in the market place. If you have very little you have little investment in maintaining social order.

Ironically if you have a great deal you are insulated from disorder and like the poor likely to use your political influence in a cavalier manner.

When the indifference and amorality of the rich and the poor reach a certain level you get the French Revolution.

To understand Trump you should read "Coming Apart: The State of White America". Trump voters are the disenchanted that haven't embraced cultural Marxism. They may become, although are not now, fascistif something isn't done to stop the dystopian world of incompetent neo liberal collectivist and their financial institution partners.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote franciscosan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec 2016 at 14:08
Not all who wander are lost, at least that is what the bumper sticker said...
no, honey, I don't need to pull over and get directions.;)
I propose that we conclude this thread, and start a new one.
I further propose that anyone who wants to give a conclusionary statement, summing up their latest statements, should do so, but I will not respond further.
I further, further propose that we start up a new thread, perhaps the topic should be how the democrats are self-destructing, is there anything to do about it, and should one do anything in response to it, or is the best response to just let it happen?  As the saying goes, when your enemy is trying to commit suicide, just stay out of the way.  Wolfie, if you won't to start up on your interpretation of such kind of topic, start it up, or i will in a couple of days.....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Dec 2016 at 00:09
Been a while since I've commented on this thread, but one passage stood out to me:

Originally posted by wolfhnd wolfhnd wrote:

Trump voters are the disenchanted that haven't embraced cultural Marxism. They may become, although are not now, fascistif something isn't done to stop the dystopian world of incompetent neo liberal collectivist and their financial institution partners.

This. I am still a relatively young man, I am politically active and active in certain other circles. Those who are TV watchers might regard my opinions with derision, but I correctly predicted the return of One Nation in Australia, Brexit, and the Trump victory all in this one year. None of that was a fluke. Who else do you know who has been as perceptive in their understanding of our current reality? Certainly none of the TV watchers. Certainly none of the newspaper readers.

Push our countries further along the Cultural Marxist agenda, impose upon us conditions of demographic suicide from which we cannot escape, and we will do everything in our power to turn back the clock 100 years. Whatever it takes.


Edited by Constantine XI - 06 Dec 2016 at 00:10
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Dec 2016 at 14:55
Create a new Wiemar Republic, and in not very many years you will have the Fourth Reich.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote es_bih Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Feb 2017 at 10:05
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toyomotor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Feb 2017 at 10:55
I admit it, I've become absorbed with the whole Donald Trump thing, and his maniacal behaviour. I've never seen such behaviour from a national leader in my life.

I've just read an article by two White House press journalists which claims that members of the senior administration are becoming more and more concerned about Trumps behaviour. A former senior White House aide has said that he holds great concern for Trump's mental health.

Being a political leader anywhere in the world, especially the western world, requires diplomatic behaviour of the highest calibre and the ability to keep his/her mouth shut sometimes when people disagree with them.

Media releases, one would think, would be handled by experienced people and signed off by the President, but not in this case, Trump engages Twitter instead to attack oponants and release information. His personal TV appearances seem to all eventually result in over exageration and bare faced lies.

Donald Trump is the buffoon of the western political world, or he's mentally unbalances. Probably both.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote franciscosan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Feb 2017 at 11:16
Let it go for now, toyomotor.
We are definitely in uncharted waters.
But I wouldn't necessarily place much faith in the 
media coverage, not that they are 'out to get him'
just that they don't like Republicans in general.
Trump has met their antagonism, and doubled it,
and so fed the fire.
It is not a lie if nobody would reasonably believe it.
Trump tries to shock, and provoke and he succeeds.
Question is, can he stop responding to the media buzz
(which is responding to him), and get on with the job.
or is he stuck with them mirroring him, mirroring them,
etc.
But I tend to think Trump is crazy like a fox, whether that
will work at all, is another question.

You might watch the Candidates, about Clinton and Trump.
If you have to obsess about him, get a little better background,
biography wise.  You should understand that he prizes
shallowness.  What you see is very much what you get, at
the moment. he's a centimeter deep.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wolfhnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Feb 2017 at 19:41
Carry on with the ad hominem.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toyomotor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 2017 at 00:04
franciscoan-I don't think that "absorbed" is the right word, just that I, and apparently many others, await with baited breath each days revelation of what he has said and done.

I don't know his biography, and I wouldn't have thought that it would show him in a better light.

As for wolfhnds allegation of ad hominem, I suppose he's right, but DJR has brought it all upon himself, and I don't need to read the US media to confirm that.

Let's face it, he's provided a diversion from all of the bad news happening elsewhere around the globe. Wink 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Vanuatu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 2017 at 03:56
DJT is different from Obama who brought the destruction, not on himself but on the country.

Ultra racist in the media and Hollywood would use the racial tensions in this country to gain political support.

The land of low information social media has been  an engineer of Fake News, leading to lies and distortions accepted as truth or the only way to win lie. During the campaign, Project Veritas has DNC organizers on video admitting to renting cars so that paid agitators could destroy North Carolina, since the buses were noticed after Ferguson riots. So much more nasty plotting to do physical harm and disrupt campaign efforts.

You have democrat operatives plotting to attend Trump rally in California who were told to agitate the crowd to illicit violent response. Every story of "I was attacked at Trump Rally" was recanted. 

Now is DNC bankrolling current violent demonstrations at Berkeley and NY? Objective- middle age men find young unarmed woman wearing Trump hat and pepper spray her eyes just for being there. I don't know how a man of accomplishment with any pride would respond to the abusive, ill, urine soaked panties of the American mainstream press. 

Trump won an election without the press. He won with full court press against him by the media. While they maintained (and do maintain) a constant assault on every word he says. After giving Obama a free pass for two terms. Who can respect this?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toyomotor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Feb 2017 at 11:44
Just read that Trump's having a rethink on the so-called Travel Bans, following Supreme Court rejection of his plans.

Could it be that he's beginning to realise that what he says doesn't necessarily go?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote franciscosan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Feb 2017 at 13:05
I don't know what you mean by "panties" and I don't want to know.

Did the DNC use dirty tricks?  Possibly.  Although I would think they would have the sense to separate themselves from such behavior, and not openly condone it.  That is different than condemning it or discouraging it.  Should such behavior be discouraged?  Yes.  Should Trump not joke about someone assassinating Hillary?  Yes.  Obviously hubris or fatal pride has caught up with the Democrats lately.  I am just wondering how much of the Republican party will go down, when Trump's boat sinks.  Do I want that to happen?  Much as I don't like him, no, because it will cost the country.

Does the press like it when he looks bad, yes.  But is it purely just the press doing that.  No.  He is a master of chaos, but those around him can't take it, and stress is showing.  Will he learn, I doubt so in any substantive ways.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Vanuatu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Feb 2017 at 13:33
Originally posted by toyomotor toyomotor wrote:

Just read that Trump's having a rethink on the so-called Travel Bans, following Supreme Court rejection of his plans.

Could it be that he's beginning to realise that what he says doesn't necessarily go?



It could be that Judge shopping in the ultra liberal 9th circuit court has given a temporary stay. Now Trump's Attorney General- J. Sessions has been sworn in. He will bring it to a higher court who will uphold the order because it is constitutional. As the Chief Diplomat the President can ban travel.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Vanuatu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Feb 2017 at 13:39
Originally posted by franciscosan franciscosan wrote:

I don't know what you mean by "panties" and I don't want to know.

Did the DNC use dirty tricks?  Possibly.  Although I would think they would have the sense to separate themselves from such behavior, and not openly condone it.  That is different than condemning it or discouraging it.  Should such behavior be discouraged?  Yes.  Should Trump not joke about someone assassinating Hillary?  Yes.  Obviously hubris or fatal pride has caught up with the Democrats lately.  I am just wondering how much of the Republican party will go down, when Trump's boat sinks.  Do I want that to happen?  Much as I don't like him, no, because it will cost the country.

Does the press like it when he looks bad, yes.  But is it purely just the press doing that.  No.  He is a master of chaos, but those around him can't take it, and stress is showing.  Will he learn, I doubt so in any substantive ways.

Maybe he should golf 4 times a week like Obama did to avoid stress. The DNC used dirty tricks against the DNC ! LOL. Ask Bernie Sanders. What happened to blabber mouth Schultz? You didn't watch Nancy Pelosi coaching people to play the muslim card?  Hollywood, mainstream media and leftists have not ceased to obstruct and  create chaos. Funny that you keep calling Trump chaotic.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote franciscosan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Feb 2017 at 13:45
The original judge that overturned the ban was a W. Bush appointee (or so I've heard), I don't think he was a knee jerk liberal.

The conservative commentator Krauthammer said that the travel ban was legal and stupid.  The commentator David Brooks agreed.

Trump's own appointee to Supreme Court has commented on Trump's criticism of the courts.

Trump has decided not to press it for now.  If he had bothered to do it right and go through Congress, well, shoulda coulda woulda.
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