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African phenotypes

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    Posted: 11 Sep 2009 at 01:45
This a continuation of the topic created by Calvo in the Archive forum, which was very interesting. My expertise lies with the Horn of Africa but i will try to cover as many regions and phenotypes of Africa as possible:
 
Horn of Africa
 
Hararis
 
 
 
Ancient City of Harar, Ethiopia
 
 
 
Somalis
 
Old City of Merka, Somalia
Taleeh, Somalia
 
Amharas
 
Castle city of Gondar, Ethiopia
Lalibela, Ethiopia
 
To be continued.
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Afars
 
 
 
Tadjoura, Djibouti
 
Djibouti City
 
Tigray-Tigrinyas
 
 
 
Axum, Ethiopia
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AksumVanguard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Sep 2009 at 12:31
When you say African Phenotypes you are specifically talking about  Africa right cause there is a broad range of phenotypes in the Americas and Elsewhere. Nonetheless there is a broad range of phenotypes in the sub -saharan region itself. As I said in a post a time back. There is 3 major classifications for Sub-Saharan there is the Negroid-supposedly introduced by the Bantu, then you have the Capoid or the Capid subjects, then Ethiopic Races. These were all classified according to Coons taxonomy.

In my opinion with the  Nigerians I know ,the Sengalese,HOA, South Africans,and Ghanians phenotype is not necessarily tribal based. I've never been to Southern Africa, but in some of these countries such as Uganda , Tanzania, and Mozambique hold a vast array phenotypes to be seen.  Tanzanians claim they have some arab mixture or I was told, and some of them may display the narrow noses,hook noses,aquailine noses, and broad noses. There is also  different shades of skin.

Uganda I am told may have some who have a vast array of features but are mainly dark skin.Again these facial and physical features are not necessarily tribal but ,the different physical appearances occur  individually in  most areas,this is probably due to the break down of tribalism as can be exemplified in the case of Zambia were miners constantly threatened by unfair conditions different tribes put aside their different ethnic tribal obligations for a cause of laborer rights.Zambia has no alot of intermarriages within these tribes

Anyway there is also a vast array of phenotypes among some Mozambiquans who also say there are swahili descent and have encountered Arab influences but this is all speculation, I have met few people from there. Some Tanzanian features that I have seen from some websites  seem to resemble alot of Black Americans  and Carribeans features.Which mean some do not closely resemble the west africans but don't necessarily have the features of Horn of Africans either. They were also a transport of Indians and Malasysians to the Interior area during Colonial times.   I am not aware of how much Portuguese interbred with Mozambique families but this unlikely.


Some Southern African Tribes that are labeled Coloureds have different phenotypes also. There are some Bantu tribes in the region with both Bantu and Khoi-San blood, there is also some intermarriage that has occured between different tribes.

Most West Africans have a Negroid features unless you are dealing with certain Senegalese or Some Nigerians who have alot of phenotypes . One example among nigerians is the Hausa and Fulani.

The Phenotypes of Africa are hard to classify also. I posted some,but Ill be sure to find some more

Ugandan model-Kiara Kabukuru

 



South African model Kaone Kario





Somalian model Yasmin Warsame





Somalian model Kadra Ahmed Omar





Nigerian model Agbani Darego





Nigerian Nnnena from ANTM





Ethiopian model- Liya Kebede





Nigerian Model Oluchi Onweagba





Edited by AksumVanguard - 11 Sep 2009 at 17:44
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AksumVanguard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Sep 2009 at 13:07
Sorry for the pics above those were the only pics I could get my hands on at the moment.

But here are some other pics that I have found from a Uganda website. Most are ugandan women
ugandaUganda Beautiful womanUganda Beautiful womanUganda Beautiful womanUganda Beautiful womanUganda Beautiful womanUganda Beautiful womanUganda Beautiful womanUganda womenUganda womenUganda womenUganda womenUganda womenUganda women
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dolphin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Sep 2009 at 14:24
Girl in Pink above right - HAMANA HAMANA!!
 
This thread is dubious to say the least Embarrassed It's like a mixture between an escort page and a mail order bride search!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Balaam Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Sep 2009 at 14:53
Originally posted by AksumVanguard AksumVanguard wrote:

Uganda women



Scrolling down and seeing that suddenly really gives you a fright...


KKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKAAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNNNNNNGGGGGGGGGGGG!!!!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AksumVanguard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Sep 2009 at 16:52
Originally posted by Dolphin Dolphin wrote:


This thread is dubious to say the least Embarrassed It's like a mixture between an escort page and a mail order bride search!

It all depends on how you look at it, I'd figure it'll be more fair to post pics of the females who usually are  more relatively noticed. People tend not to have a problem keeping there eyes on females of ethnicity,think about staring at a female at a bar now picture staring at a male fellow,Not a good look .  But I'm sure if these girls were really looking to put out more bait for the opposite sex, they would've definitely showed out and flashed in the proper form.

Originally posted by Balaam Balaam wrote:


Scrolling down and seeing that suddenly really gives you a fright...

Uganda women


Nope, it takes alot to scare me.But I think shes just camera shy.



Edited by AksumVanguard - 11 Sep 2009 at 19:37
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Prince of Zeila Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Sep 2009 at 17:23
A.V my intention with this topic wasn't to create a 'booty thread' but instead it was ment to highlight the multiple different ethnic groups of Africa, their phenotypes and their cultures.
 
Berbers/North Africans
 
 
Ait Benhaddou, Morocco
 

M'zab, Algeria

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AksumVanguard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Sep 2009 at 18:09
Zeila

And,that was my intention also,but it is a bit difficult to propagate specific cultures and ethnicities  in order to bring forth a specific phenotype. They may vary within a tribe or ethnic group. The pictures I did post nonetheless,showed different physical features and phenotypes. The first set of pictures I posted did have different individuals from different regions of different tribes.One from South Africa, Nigeria, and Somalia they all had physical features that they shared with their kinsmen.As well as the second set of pictures I posted. You can see they all have different appearances.



 Just because the individuals in the post are wearing modern day clothing and seem to be in tuned with modern day culture does not deny the fact that it does still show different physical features.  Its not my fault that others chose to let make rather colorful comments towards the pics thats their choice.





Nigerian Fulani



http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_9etVnS4R1As/SDVH2hfTcqI/AAAAAAAAEyM/hWAGFW--1Sw/s400/1200NigeriaFulaniWodaabe11.jpg

http://www.scottnicholsgallery.com/artists/margo-davis/images/margo-davis_fulani-girl-nigeria-1981.jpg














































Edited by AksumVanguard - 12 Sep 2009 at 14:42
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Prince of Zeila Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Sep 2009 at 18:38
You missed my point A.V.  In your second reply you posted a gallery of women and dubbed them 'Ugandan women', but from which of the dozens of ethnic groups in Uganda are these women from?, there is not such thing as a ethnic group called Ugandan, it's a nationality.
 
Tuaregs
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AksumVanguard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Sep 2009 at 19:19
Originally posted by Prince Of Zeila Prince Of Zeila wrote:

You missed my point A.V.  In your second reply you posted a gallery of women and dubbed them 'Ugandan women', but from which of the dozens of ethnic groups in Uganda are these women from?, there is not such thing as a ethnic group called Ugandan, it's a nationality.

Exactly, as I said the different phenotypes occuring in different African tribes show a vast array of diversity. But contrary to belief, different phenotypes can be displayed in a vast array within one tribe. Some genealogist and ethnographers are trying to make sense of this,by saying this is due to the recent interbreeding and intermarriage amongst the tribes. Individuals intermarrying with another tribe is sort of taboo and is somewhat frowned upon in Africa,but it is however occuring.  If there was any kind of specific classification of phenotype that appeared amongst a tribe, in ealrier times before intermarrying, you can assure yourself that you will not see this today.

When I posted the Ugandan pics I could not find which tribe they belong to. Nor did I chose to do that with the first pics. But that is the tricky part because a lot of times, tribes living within one region may look the alike sometimes,other times they don't. Depending on the location tribes may have similar appearances within a proximity and others instances they do not.


Hausa

http://maflib.mtandao-afrika.net/TQA01113/hausa.9.gif



















HAUSA





YORUBA



IGBO











EFIK/IBIBIO


CALABAR








FULANI/WOODABE












MANGA KANURI
















Edited by AksumVanguard - 11 Sep 2009 at 19:34
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Easternbul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Sep 2009 at 11:13
Can someone find photos of Northern Africans with germanic influence?
We have got some Morrocans here and one of them is very dark brown and has got red hair.
And a friend of my his brother has got dark blond hairs and light blue eyes.They are from Morroco too.He told me that they are coming from the Morrocan coast.

Very interessting.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AksumVanguard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Sep 2009 at 15:10
Originally posted by Prince of Zeila Prince of Zeila wrote:

You missed my point A.V.  In your second reply you posted a gallery of women and dubbed them 'Ugandan women', but from which of the dozens of ethnic groups in Uganda are these women from?, there is not such thing as a ethnic group called Ugandan, it's a nationality.





My depictions of different ethnic groups did not intend to be vague and imprecise.  I attempted to post a generic photos of physical attributes in a particular region,meaning from country to country. As with proximiti in a continent or proximities  within a country,you can draw affinities and dissimilarities depending on your range or scope of measure.

Now if I take your example with pictures you posted of Berbers, they are particular tribes within a Berber population of North Africa and are likewise, a vast spectrum of physical features within assigned distances among the populace. This will depend on districts,provinces, or countries of North Africa. Now we can say Berber is not a nationality or a tribe,but I do know what you mean. Berbers are a distinctive people despite encompassing a mass populace of tribes and ethnicities within the North Africa.

I was not aware that you did also want to include architectural designs in this thread, but if you do not mind I will like to add some myself ,if I can find them LOL.I really find it hard to come across some of the Africas discovered ancient structures since they are numerous finds in the Sub -Sahara. The Mupungwa had had over 800 cities and towns but they are not shown on the web. So on for the Gaza empire and the Rowzi but I will see what I can do. BTW I just updated the Fulani post.Nice pics though.


Kuba (Sankuru- DRC)
Suku/Yaka (Bandundu DRC/Northwest Angola)
 




(Sudanic) Azande- CAR/DRC/CHAD/SUDAN








Gikuyu People of Kenya





















Igbo People








Igbo People

Emeka Okafor



Chikezie



Caroline Chikezie



Nnenna Freelon



Kele Okereke



Leo Ihenacho



Victor Anichebe



Osi Umenyiora



Carlton Cole



Toju



Banky W






Edited by AksumVanguard - 12 Sep 2009 at 15:45
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"jebala people":







 "Riffain people":









3º west-central Morocco "souss people":











4º north west algeria "kabylie people":









All Individuals Below belong  to Igbo Tribe































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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote calvo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Sep 2009 at 19:26
Very good photos.
The people who I find with the most distinctive features are the Bushmen. Their faces look somewhat Mongoloid.
There are other Africans who also exhibit Mongoloid traits such as slanting eyes.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AksumVanguard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2009 at 07:18
Originally posted by calvo calvo wrote:

Very good photos.
The people who I find with the most distinctive features are the Bushmen. Their faces look somewhat Mongoloid.
There are other Africans who also exhibit Mongoloid traits such as slanting eyes.


I'm glad you have taken notice,yes some people would say that certain African Tribes exhibit Mongoloid features,these are common in Tribes such as the Xhosa and other tribes with mixed Bantu and Khoisan ancestry.they common misconception is that alot of Khoisans were killed of by the Bantus,not all of them. Some of them did intergrate within the tribes making some hybrids. Mongoloid  features can also be noticed in Congolese peoples like the  Bakonga and L ubaba.




Himba Tribe


Peter Gasser Photography: Himba Tribe, Northwestern Namibia, 2000

Peter Gasser Photography: Himba Tribe, Northwestern Namibia, 2000


Peter Gasser Photography: Hamer Tribe, Southwestern Ethiopia, 2000





Peter Gasser Photography: Karo Tribe, Southwestern Ethiopia, 2000


Peter Gasser Photography: Samburu Tribe, Northern Kenya, 2000

Peter Gasser Photography: Samburu Tribe, Northern Kenya, 2000
Xhosa

Xhosa woman with beret or cap on her head

Ethnic African man with a writing book and pen in his hands





Smiling Nelson Mandela , Johannesburg ( November 2008 ) stock photo







http://www.cca.ukzn.ac.za/images/pa/pa2006/images/Mbangeni-Jessica/Xhosa-03.jpg









http://www.satravelco.com/images/xhosa_dress.jpg




http://rcdaugherty.com/NewFiles/Xhosa-Woman.jpg










http://img1.photographersdirect.com/img/5170/wm/pd110204.jpg









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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dolphin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2009 at 10:13
I find it hard to accept some of the pictures on this thread. The tendency for a lot of model agencies and those photographing individuals is to find not only the best looking, but more dangerously, the most Westernised/Caucausoid features. If you look at the glamour images, the women involved have generaly got features more readily associable with white women than black women, and that to me clouds any sort of solid phenotyping or grouping according to 'ethnic groups'.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Prince of Zeila Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2009 at 11:11

Originally posted by AksumVanguard AksumVanguard wrote:

Originally posted by Prince of Zeila Prince of Zeila wrote:

You missed my point A.V. In your second reply you posted a gallery of women and dubbed them 'Ugandan women', but from which of the dozens of ethnic groups in Uganda are these women from?, there is not such thing as a ethnic group called Ugandan, it's a nationality.



My depictions of different ethnic groups did not intend to be vague and imprecise. I attempted to post a generic photos of physical attributes in a particular region,meaning from country to country. As with proximiti in a continent or proximities within a country,you can draw affinities and dissimilarities depending on your range or scope of measure.

Sure some regions in Africa overlap in Phenotype because historically ethnic groups might have intermarried, but it's disingeneous to claim that the average Nigerian Yoruba can't differentiate a Fulani from an Igbo or a Zulu(S.Africa) from an Amhara etc.

Quote Now if I take your example with pictures you posted of Berbers, they are particular tribes within a Berber population of North Africa and are likewise, a vast spectrum of physical features within assigned distances among the populace. This will depend on districts,provinces, or countries of North Africa. Now we can say Berber is not a nationality or a tribe,but I do know what you mean. Berbers are a distinctive people despite encompassing a mass populace of tribes and ethnicities within the North Africa.
 
I grew up with Berbers, i know what they look like on average and there is no doubt in my mind that they have a very distinct look that was represented in my gallery. The Berber situation is very different from the Ugandan, first; all 'Berber tribes' speak an Afro-Asiatic language and phenotypically the vast majority are of the same type. Amongst Ugandans however you can find nilotics, bantus and a whole set of other people with their unique phenotypes and languages.

Quote I was not aware that you did also want to include architectural designs in this thread, but if you do not mind I will like to add some myself ,if I can find them .I really find it hard to come across some of the Africas discovered ancient structures since they are numerous finds in the Sub -Sahara. The Mupungwa had had over 800 cities and towns but they are not shown on the web. So on for the Gaza empire and the Rowzi but I will see what I can do. BTW I just updated the Fulani post.Nice pics though.

I liked your pics of Nigeria, very goodlooking people, do add architectural and cultural characteristics of that region if you canSmile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Prince of Zeila Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2009 at 11:17
Originally posted by Dolphin Dolphin wrote:

I find it hard to accept some of the pictures on this thread.
 
Be more specific Dolphin, which ones in particular?Smile
 
Quote The tendency for a lot of model agencies and those photographing individuals is to find not only the best looking, but more dangerously, the most Westernised/Caucausoid features. If you look at the glamour images, the women involved have generaly got features more readily associable with white women than black women, and that to me clouds any sort of solid phenotyping or grouping according to 'ethnic groups'.
 
There are 100 million people in the Horn of Africa with those features, there is nothing Westernised or 'white' about their phenotype. It seems to me Dolphin you still believe in the outdated and discredited 'True Negro' theory.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dolphin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2009 at 11:33
Nope, I mention the glamour pictures only, and I maintain the regardless of where the model is supposedly from, Westernised features are preferred, and thus the pictures are unreliable as any sort of evidence or classing according to ethnicity.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Prince of Zeila Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2009 at 11:41
Are you telling me that Ethiopian and Somali models like Liya Kebede and Yasmin Warsame( and there 'features') are exceptions rather than the rule in these two populations? These models are actually considered 'average looking' to most Ethiopian and Somali men.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2009 at 12:09
If they're average looking how do they get jobs as models? Confused
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Prince of Zeila Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2009 at 12:30
Originally posted by gcle2003 gcle2003 wrote:

If they're average looking how do they get jobs as models? Confused
 

Greetings Gcl,

Because they are still model material, this however does not mean they are universally considered beautiful, or that there 'features' are 'rare'.  I personally know a handful of women that look better than them but they study medicine etc, i was disputing Dolphin's earlier statement that models couldn't be considered representatives of their regions' when they clearly can. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AksumVanguard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Sep 2009 at 15:58
Originally posted by Prince of Zeila Prince of Zeila wrote:


Sure some regions in Africa overlap in Phenotype because historically ethnic groups might have intermarried, but it's disingeneous to claim that the average Nigerian Yoruba can't differentiate a Fulani from an Igbo or a Zulu(S.Africa) from an Amhara etc

That is a taking it out of context a bit, I never compared an African country 1000 miles away from another African country, to share the same phenotypes.  But different ethnic groups within a country would have physical affinities, tribes may have once been a consolidated union of bond. These tribes may have broken off and formed there own groups .

If they are living within the same country,some some tribes may have intergrated with one another,some may have stayed isolated. But even a population within may still have its own distinct look. Just as one looks at an African and can tell whether the individual is from East Africa or West Africa. And within East Africa you can look at certain tribes like they Oromo which would be dark skinned compared to Tigrinya which are lighter complected.  But if your living in West Africa you would know the difference from the Wolof who look differrent from the Igbo. But if you are new to the area it would be hard categorizing them.

They are some who would classify Eastern Africans with Ugandans and Mozambiquans because to some they have similar features. But they are East Africans who are from the Horn Of Africa and some from Central East Africa.




Originally posted by AksumVanguard AksumVanguard wrote:



Now if I take your example with pictures you posted of Berbers, they are particular tribes within a Berber population of North Africa and are likewise, a vast spectrum of physical features within assigned distances among the populace. This will depend on districts,provinces, or countries of North Africa. Now we can say Berber is not a nationality or a tribe,but I do know what you mean. Berbers are a distinctive people despite encompassing a mass populace of tribes and ethnicities within the North Africa.


Originally posted by Prince of Zeila Prince of Zeila wrote:


I grew up with Berbers, i know what they look like on average and there is no doubt in my mind that they have a very distinct look that was represented in my gallery. The Berber situation is very different from the Ugandan,





Originally posted by Prince Of Zeila Prince Of Zeila wrote:


first; all 'Berber tribes' speak an Afro-Asiatic language and phenotypically the vast majority are of the same type. Amongst Ugandans however you can find nilotics, bantus and a whole set of other people with their unique phenotypes and languages.


The Ugandan languages, whether they are Nilotic or Bantu are all Hamitic languages,so I don't know what you are trying to imply. The Berber tribes whether they are of Sanhaja or the Zenata all have their languages.  Of course most berbers may speak Arabic today, but they all had their own languages at one time. Each Berber Tribe may have their own distinct look. The Riffain people have alot of  Red hair and European traits  compared to the Souss have more of a Middle Eastern look.

They are also the Libyan and Egyptian Berbers who appear to be a little darker than their counterpart Berbers


Originally posted by Prince Of Zeila Prince Of Zeila wrote:


I liked your pics of Nigeria, very goodlooking people, do add architectural and cultural characteristics of that region if you canSmile







Kano City Walls


Kanos city walls




Kano City Walls























Edited by AksumVanguard - 15 Sep 2009 at 16:00
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AksumVanguard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Sep 2009 at 16:36
Originally posted by Dolphin Dolphin wrote:


Nope, I mention the glamour pictures only, and I maintain the regardless of where the model is supposedly from, Westernised features are preferred, and thus the pictures are unreliable as any sort of evidence or classing according to ethnicity.


There is a reason why I posted some pics of Africans who have Mongoloid features and some who may have Caucasoid features. The fact is that Africa is very diversified, and yes one phenotype in one ethnicty is not enough to classify a standardized phenotype for that tribe or people. But you can definitely expect people who may possibly look like her in that ethnicity, especially ones  from her family. The Nigerians who I consider the most beautiful on the continent may show varying degrees of diversity,some may be slim built,while others are naturally muscle toned. As you can see in the pictures, that they are some Igbo who are naturally light skined and others that are very dark skinned.They are some with some caucasoid features or intermediate  features with negroid or other features.

Comparing the phenotype classification of African tribes comes with great contraversy. Some would say that africans don't have a diversity. Ethnographers would say  certain africans eyes epicanthic folds compared  to East Asians  are not the same because they are not the same size. Well they haven't taken into account that they may share a different skull size,and forgot to include the factor of facial proportion and facial ratio.  This will be the same factor in measuring the facial proportion and facial ration with noses.

I agree that model picture are not definitive, but you can believe that individuals  from Fulani who number in 20 million(with alot of broken off tribes which would make 36 to 40 million) and Igbo who number in 27 million all have a wide of varieties of physical atrributes. They are also spread all through out West Africa,therefore classifying what is an african feature and what isn't is a bit dilluted.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Easternbul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Sep 2009 at 13:20
In my neighbourhood we have an African and he is very dark brown but the best thing is the hair.He has got red hair.I think he is from Morocco.My other Morrocan friend has got a younger brother and he looks Germanic.Light skin,blue eyes,blond hair.
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